The Evolving Landscape of Digital Innovation: Insights on livestream economy, immersive digital ecosystems, gaming, and AI with Jessica Berger

Episode Notes:

Have you ever thought about having a digital twin?

In this episode of Up Next in Tech, I sit down with Jessica Berger, SVP of Innovation at Publicis Media. Admirably known for her insight and understanding of cutting-edge technology, Jessica shares her expertise on trends like web3, AI, extended reality, and gaming. In this conversation, we focused on 4 emerging trends that Jessica's team highlighted in their recent trends report called, Future Forward. The report included topics like instant content to commerce, immersive digital ecosystems, AI's impact on identity and social life, and the revolutionary implications of gaming's evolution on brands. The episode also sheds light on Jessica's personal definition of innovation and how she nurtures her curiosity, opening up interesting questions around the adoption of virtual try-on technologies and the possibility of using a digital twin.

So if any of these trends interest you, be sure to check out the episode and let me know what you think about virtual try on technologies or any of the trends we mentioned!

Also, check out the glossary below that breaks down a lot of the new words that come up on this episode. It’s a new thing we’re trying, so let us know if you like it.

Follow along:

01:39 Jessica’s definition of Innovation
04:00 Nurturing Curiosity and Innovator's Mindset
13:58 Personal Use of Generative AI
19:27 Identifying Trends and Directions
21:38 Instant Content to Commerce Technology
24:06 The Future of Branded Content
24:49 Ethical Considerations in the Digital Age
32:08 The Intersection of AI and Identity
32:59 The Potential of Virtual Try-Ons
35:01 The Role of Blockchain in Authenticity and Equity
36:45 The Future of AI and Content Creation
42:34 Nurturing Mental Health and Curiosity

Referenced on the Episode:

Future Forward Trends Report by Publicis Media Innovation Team

NFT Now

Rishad Tobaccowala

Cassie Kozyrkov - former Chief Decision Scientist at Google

Shira Lazar

Allie K Millier

Matt Klein

Guest Bio: Jessica Berger

Jessica Berger leads innovation and strategy at Publicis Media by harnessing the power of emerging technologies and insights. With an industry reputation for her unwavering enthusiasm and profound understanding of cutting-edge tech, such as web3, AI, and AR/VR, Berger has become a sought-after speaker, judge, and host at industry events. Her expertise lies in deciphering the future of media and brand experiences, enabling her clients to capitalize on the potential of breakthrough innovations.

Moreover, her dedication to mentorship and advocacy for diverse voices in organizations like the Adweek Executive Mentorship program and Girls In Tech exemplifies her commitment to empowering the next generation of marketers and thinkers. Prior to joining Publicis, Berger worked at agency powerhouses Weber Shandwick and Publicis’ MSL where she strategized and implemented campaigns and digital innovation efforts for clients in the luxury goods, CPG and tech sectors. Her over a decade-long experience is informed by working for agencies and companies across Germany, Japan, and North America – giving her a unique global edge valued by many clients and industry peers.

Glossary of Terms:

Emerging Technology: New technologies just starting to be used, like self-driving cars, 5G networks, or advanced robotics. These could significantly change our daily lives or work in the future.

Innovation: Creating new ideas or products that improve things. For example, the development of smartphones was an innovation that changed how we communicate and access information.

Livestream Economy: Making money through live video broadcasts online. This includes gamers streaming on platforms like Twitch, or artists performing live concerts online.

Virtual Try-On Technologies: Digital tools to preview products on yourself, like seeing how glasses look on your face using an app before buying them.

Digital Ecosystems: Networks of digital products and services. An example is the Apple ecosystem, where your iPhone, iPad, Mac, and Apple Watch all work seamlessly together.

Immersive Experiences: Experiences that use technology to create a sense of being in a different place. Virtual reality games are a prime example, where players feel like they're in a completely different world.

Augmented Reality (AR): Adding digital elements to the real world. Pokémon Go is a popular example, where players catch digital creatures appearing in their real-world environment.

Virtual Reality (VR): Experiencing and interacting with a digital world through a headset. Games like Beat Saber or VR simulations used for training pilots are examples.

Mixed Reality (XR): Combining real and digital worlds. For instance, Microsoft's HoloLens allows users to interact with 3D holograms in their physical space.

Artificial Intelligence (AI): Machines thinking and learning like humans. A common example is voice assistants like Siri or Alexa, which can understand and respond to voice commands.

Generative AI: AI creating new content. This includes AI that can compose music or create realistic-looking images based on descriptions.

Predictive AI: AI predicting future events. For example, AI used by streaming services to suggest movies you might like based on your past viewing habits.

Chatbots: are computer programs designed for conversation. Many companies use chatbots on their websites to answer customer questions automatically.

Digital Twins: Digital copies of real objects or systems. For example, a digital twin of a wind turbine can help in monitoring its performance and predicting maintenance needs.

NPCs (Non-Player Characters): Characters in games not controlled by players. In a game like Skyrim, NPCs are the characters you interact with who are controlled by the game itself.

Avatars: Digital characters representing a person. In the gaming world, your avatar is the character you create to represent yourself.

Web3: The next internet phase, focusing on decentralized networks. Cryptocurrencies and decentralized finance (DeFi) platforms are part of this movement.

Blockchain: A way of storing data that's hard to change. Bitcoin's public ledger, which records all transactions in a secure, transparent way, is an example.

Cryptocurrency: Digital money, like Bitcoin or Ethereum, which operates independently of a central bank and is secured by cryptography.

NFTs (Non-Fungible Tokens): Unique digital items using blockchain. For example, digital artwork that can be bought and sold as an NFT, proving its uniqueness and ownership.

Deepfakes: Realistic AI-generated fake videos or audios. An example is a video that appears to show a celebrity saying something they never actually said.

Quantum Computing: A powerful computing form using quantum mechanics. It has potential applications in fields like cryptography and complex material simulation.

Subscription Models: Regular payments for ongoing services. Netflix is a well-known example, where you pay monthly to access their streaming content.

Influencer Marketing: Using social media influencers to promote products. A beauty blogger promoting a skincare brand on Instagram is an example.

Social Commerce: Buying and selling through social media. Instagram Shopping allows users to purchase products directly through the app.

Hyper-Consumerism: Buying more than needed, often driven by advertising. Black Friday shopping sprees are a classic example.

Transparency: Openness in operations. A company might be transparent about its supply chain to show ethical sourcing of materials.

Authentication: Proving something is real. Luxury brands often include authentication certificates with their products to prove they are not counterfeit.

Royalties: Payments to creators for their work. Musicians receive royalties every time their song is played on the radio or streamed online.

Intellectual Property (IP): Legal rights to creations. Patents for inventions, copyrights for books and music, and trademarks for brand logos are examples of IP.

Ariba Jahan: Welcome to Up Next in Tech, a podcast exploring the intersection of emerging technology, responsible innovation, and the way we live, play, and interact. I'm your host, Ariba Jahan, and this podcast is essentially a reflection of my curiosity about how New industries are created and how emerging technology plays a role and how new careers and new skills get shaped.
So on every episode, I bring on a guest that I'm deeply inspired by, we dive into how they got started because the careers they have today did not exist 10 years ago. And we unpack the nascent industry that they're working in, as well as the emerging tech that they're building or utilizing. We get into the tension they might be grappling with or where they're finding inspiration.
In this episode, I sit down with Jessica Berger, who leads innovation and strategy at Publicis Media by harnessing the power of emerging technologies and insights. She has an industry wide reputation for her unwavering enthusiasm and understanding of cutting edge tech, like web3 AI, augmented reality, as well as virtual reality. What sparked this conversation is I recently saw her post on LinkedIn, this AI generated video to promote the trends report her team put out. I loved the video, thought it was playful I dug into the report and really enjoyed it and thought this could be a fun conversation. I invited Jessica to join us and that's what we talk about on this episode. You'll hear us mention the 4 different trends in the report, but we dig deep into 2 specifically.
So the 4 trends are instant content to commerce, especially in this live stream economy, immersive digital ecosystems. AI being at the crossroads of identity and social life and how gaming's evolution is catalyzing brands revolution. We also get into her definition of innovation and how she nurtures her curiosity.
So check out the episode and let us know which trend are you most interested about? are you using virtual try on technologies when you shop these days? Would you use a digital twin? I'm curious. Check it out. can't wait to hear from you.
Ariba Jahan: Jessica, I am so excited that we're finally doing this conversation.
Jessica Berger: Thank you so much for having me long overdue. So thank you so much.
Ariba Jahan: Yeah. I think what was super cool was, when I first realized you've had so many unique experiences, you've studied in Japan, you have all background in language, but you work in digital innovation and those are not the typical dots people might connect and I would love to hear how did you end up working in innovation?
Jessica Berger: background, the randomness of it all is sort of actually, serving in my favor, like many others when I went to college back in the day, back then digital marketing, the way we know it today was not available and marketing back then felt very boring.
Jessica Berger: So I did something entirely different. And travel quite a bit and, Explore the world, spend some time in Japan. Like you mentioned, that was good time for me to explore and see what else is out there. And then ultimately, as social media came of age and became something that you could actually tangibly conceptualize and make use of, I started working in social media marketing and influencer marketing back when that was barely a thing, very unknown, and no one really knew what to make of it, but that's how I started at a startup. and from there, just went through all the positions and all the various spots you could possibly hold in digital marketing and learn what is actually out there and what about digital is interesting to me As I learned more and the more senior I got in my specific roles, I learned that it's not about the actual digital marketing campaigns that we ran or the ads that we run, but rather looking ahead and thinking, okay, what else is out there, what else is out there that we could actually do? And so innovation became more and more like a real thing. And that's how I got, where I'm today.
Ariba Jahan: so when you first started working in innovation and it's possible, like, many of our industries, the nomenclature and the taxonomy evolves. So how do you define innovation now versus how you might've defined before?
Jessica Berger: depending on who you ask, you always get a different answer. I get that. and innovation is so broad, right? But because I work at publicist, which is a media agency, of course, I look through everything through the marketing and media lens. So for me, it's all about the content, the medium, the format that we touch in our digital worlds that we engage in every single day, what are the technologies that sort of impact that?
Jessica Berger: where is that technology that actually causes a change in the content that we're consuming or creating? And so that's how I look at innovation and what it is that covers my remit of innovation. So that's media at large, but that's also emerging technologies.
Ariba Jahan: with emerging technologies also like emerging experiences, new ways of creating that experience that might not have existed before, and that changes all the time. what has been surprising for you in this journey of yours and working in innovation and content and marketing?
Jessica Berger so many surprises every single day. So I think the interesting part is because if you work in an agency, you work with different clients across the board, right? Different industries, different verticals every single day, and all of them have different interests and different needs. So every single day, there's a good chance that you have different tasks coming across your desk, anything from, can you.
Jessica Berger Explain what AI is to what are the imperatives for the automotive industry to here's a new creative idea. How can we use AR to bring that to life? So, there's a whole range of things that you every single day encounter and the best part about it is that you just every single day have to tackle new challenges and learn something new and then have the conversation about what is innovation.
Jessica Berger What does that mean to a. Client, Cause innovation to us might mean one thing as far as emerging technologies, but we're very much at the forefront there and pioneering that. But when comes to a good chunk of clients that might actually be, okay, maybe we're talking about an AR filter and TikTok, right?
Jessica Berger Very different conversation. bringing all the knowledge and the expertise of the clients, but then also having a conversation about, okay, what does that mean to you? And where can we go and take this?
Ariba Jahan: Yeah, how do you translate it to someone's business and their application? Right? So emerging tech is like a catch all term and what is emerging in the moment will shift. when you and I first met. We were talking about the metaverse and now we're talking and we've seen the cycle go frommetaverse dialogue and even NFTs.
Ariba Jahan: Right?digital collectibles were at a peak at the moment. And now what we're seeing is more about AI, digital identities and digital twins. Right? So I think, the conversation is always shifting. So I'm curious, How do you nurture that curiosity and that innovators mindset when you know that the space is shifting so often and you have to separate the signal and the noise?
Jessica Berger for me personally, it's all about diving right in. You really have to test and learn for yourself. biggest priority for me is understanding the technology by learning and by testing it yourself. So when there's a new platform, there's a new app. There's a new chat GPT feature, whatever we're all crazy about in the moment.
Jessica Berger You have to dive in and figure it out. So either you can, or you find someone else who can help you in that regard, but that's the best way to do it, right? You have to understand first and foremost yourself before you can teach it to others or explain it to others and make sense of it.
Jessica Berger And then, as you have maybe teams that you're leading or you're talking really to brands about what that means for them, it's about.
Jessica Berger Helping them also taking that first step and being open minded about, Hey, here's a new technology, but to your point, right? It's emerging, meaning it's not mainstream yet. We don't have 15 years of history of data to take a proof point and showcase as to what does or why it's useful, but it's important to know that it exists and where it may or may not be headed.
Ariba Jahan: it's so spot on. I resonated with your point around when there is something happening, you have to dive in and try it out. I know when chat GPT first came out, or even when we were exploring, immersive experiences, that's all we were doing is okay, what can we try or can we play around with, mess around with so that we understand how to explain it to somebody else?
Ariba Jahan: I saw recently you used AI to convert one of your decks into a video to promote it. I really loved it. I was like, Oh, this is so playful. and I think many organizations are trying to figure out, how do we navigate AI right now, while AI has become an enabler in many ways, there are people who areat the tension between ethics and IP and, creativity.
Ariba Jahan: So how are you as an organization addressing AI? are you using it, learning it?
Jessica Berger All of it. because the report that I created and then turn it into that video or try to turn it into something else, it was a PDF. And of course you think, oh, you work in innovation. Why are you sharing a PDF? That seems very old school and dated. Shouldn't you think of something new, right?
Jessica Berger And the idea is, of course, the report itself is meant for people Who's nine to five is not to think about innovation, right? They're not the you and me of the world who think about emerging technology all day long, but the people who actually need to know a little bit more about the world because it's new to them.
Jessica Berger So for that reason, because easy sharing of email is still very much going on, it makes it easier to share it around and for people to actually see it. So PDF. All the way, but the idea is of course, given all the various platforms from open AI to everything else that's out there, how can you actually use that?
Jessica Berger And so the idea is always to, experiment and test and see what you can do. And for example, trend reports are a great example. So quite a few people collecting all the various reports that are currently buzzing around because it's that time of the year. And then creating, GPT is trend GPT essentially, right?
Jessica Berger loading the reports into chat GPT to then make it a trend GPT, which I love it's really awesome. Of course, the idea is, hey, why would I need to read all of it? If I can just upload it.
Jessica Berger But then when I tested quite a few of them out,
Ariba Jahan: Yeah, was it
Jessica Berger If I share my PDF, it's easy for you to just open the doc and just scroll through and glimpse at all the content pieces and you're being guided by whatever I share in that content piece.
Jessica Berger You are not being challenged to ask, okay, what is the trend? What do I need to look for? Because here is the answer. It's on the page. When you just upload to GPT, yes, you can provide a few prompts for people to, for the user to then be like, okay, what is the trend? Tell me GPT, right?
Jessica Berger But the challenge is that you then still have to pose the question. Okay, how does a user approach that? Cause they will then have to ask the right questions. They can't ask, of course, Hey, what is the newest trend tell me and then GPT will list a whole lot of things, but will those be the right answers?
Jessica Berger You just don't know. So the challenge then becomes, okay, how do you prompt a GPT to make it useful if you can't just throw a few pages out there with images and the right points in the upfront, how do you make sure that user when they're seeing your GPT is actually asking the right questions or gets the right answers? what we did, for example, I uploaded all of those trends report as well in my GPT, of course, including my own, but then you contextualize by asking, okay, for my own brands that I work on, can you sort this by brand or by industry, give me context, or even by who are the partners and vendors that I work with, who could actually help me introduce something like that to my brand or what is the competitive advantage, like tease it out for me.
Ariba Jahan: I saw publicist GPT the trend report. Is there a publicly accessible GPT where you've uploaded all these trend reports and we can go interact with it
Jessica Berger yeah, it's not a publicly available one. Of course, the way we all use it. That's publicly available. That's public information. You don't want to feed your, sensitive information to the public or train the model on it. I think we all know that hopefully by now.
Ariba Jahan: hmm.
Jessica Berger No, but Publicis has its own GPT. So basically, we're just using a few models. The same that you would use in the public, but just limited to our needs specifically. And public data doesn't flow out.
Ariba Jahan: Yeah. And that makes sense. Cause you want to be able to curate what information it leverages, so that there is higher likelihood of accuracy to the data that you're providing and then contextualizing it to the projects that you're working on that you may not want to be public
Jessica Berger a beautiful example for internal purposes. If you're working with your own teams, use external information, feed it up into your own models, and then train your own people or help them. become better at the, content and how to ask for those questions, or, just use it as a great example.
Jessica Berger Even if you want to showcase out the clients, right? here is a great example of how you can create something for your own needs. without over complicating it, but just making it very, very useful.
Ariba Jahan: so it sounds like you all are definitely using AI in your own work. How are you using it in The behind the scenes work versus work that gets put out into the world. And I know, every organization is kind of wrangling their own AI policies. where are you all in that journey?
Jessica Berger The one layer that I would add to that is that there's always conversation between is a predictive AI or is a generative AI? Which one are we talking about? So in the ad space, we've used AI for the longest time already.
Jessica Berger Every single time you get an ad recommended and it's following you around on the internet or Amazon is showing you something that you may or may not like, that's predictive AI, right? And so recommendations or just improving the app performance, right? Which ad is performing better and potentially why? And then you build on top of that, right? So that has been around for quite some time and will always get better. the part where you use generative AI is much more interesting, much more nascent.
Jessica Berger for that reason, I think, in the particular ad space. there will take still a little bit of time, right? figuring out how to optimize your ad performance or your ad creative with the copy. I think there's ways to make that really efficient. But that's less interesting to me. I think the more interesting part is how can you actually use Generative AI for a consumer experience, for example.
Jessica Berger Helping your clients create a branded experience for their consumers to help them understand the brand better or, Add more context to how they're actually using product, for example, and the obvious use case. I think that everyone is pointing to is the chatbots, right? let's get rid of the old school chatbots that no one actually enjoys and likes to interact with and set at, for example, an AI agent, right?
Jessica Berger Or a copilot and have that be your presentation of the brand to then interact with the consumer and give a better, interaction.
Ariba Jahan: Right. And then you can control the tone and the brand of your AI personality, but then also give it a ton of information that is truthful to the brand and the FAQ style, it would have a little bit more natural language style in that conversation potentially.
Ariba Jahan: Right.
Jessica Berger ideally, you make sure that whatever interface you're choosing, if it's an avatar or not, speaks the brand language and the tone and voice and has it down to a T and then personalize that experience to you, right? Ariba versus me, Jessica. how does the AI talk to me versus you, for example, in the context of what you're doing at that moment?
Ariba Jahan: So the other thing I was curious about is how are you approaching, educating the staff? I know you are part of the innovation team. You are an SVP of innovation, but is it the only team that is getting, familiar with this technology, with is it the larger Publicis?
Ariba Jahan: how are you all approaching who dabbles in it, who uses it and who learns it?
Jessica Berger Yeah, that's a really good question. And I think it's always astonishing to me when people think, because you're working at Publicist and it's a media agency, you must not have any. AI experts or no technical experts that were specialized in certain areas, right? The same way most people don't know that we have a head of gaming or a head of blockchain, for example, which is why it was very important for me in my report to actually include the people who have dedicated their careers to these expertise and subject matter experts, or categories.
Jessica Berger And in the same way, we have lots of creative technologists. We have an army of people who focus on nothing else, but actually the technology behind the scenes. mostly, just lots of people who either are very familiar with technologies already, who have long standing history in working in AI and actually have done this before, or just lots of newcomers, hand raisers who want to learn, obviously, and want to understand what new technology is, because it's also important.
Jessica Berger And at this point, you can't go around. Having to educate your entire organization, it would be a miss if you wouldn't share that information and give access to some degree. So people can actually figure out how to use it and what to do with it. Educate them properly. Otherwise, they will likely do it, whether or not you're going to educate them on it,
Jessica Berger so you're going to have to give them some pointers or give them access to it. Some sort of tool to really help them in that regard.
Ariba Jahan: Absolutely. And think that's so right. It's already out of the box. Everyone has access to it. And so if you're not rallying around it to see this is how. We are, as an organization going to use it. This is how the guardrails we're going to follow. You just have an unknown amount of Pandora's box proliferating through your organization.
Ariba Jahan: to your point, knowing that there are so many others, either curious about it, or they're also working on it, but through a different lens, whether it's gaming or blockchain and then rallying it together too.
Jessica Berger We had our year, recap meetings earlier this week. think the number was still not 100, 000 people at work at this point at pubis globally, right across agency. That's a massive amount of number of people So imagine, having first of all to wrangle all of that, but also.
Jessica Berger Making sure that everyone receives the same amount of information or access to tools and apps. So there's huge efforts going on behind the scene, of course, to help make that happen. but I'm very happy. First of all, that the agency is doing it in the way they're doing it. And then that we're able to actually help you take that lesson learned and actually help our clients in the same way to make sure that they can, transfer either their needs or help them educate on what's needed and what their priorities are and how to integrate those.
Ariba Jahan: So individually, just focusing on Jessica, how you use generative AI. So we've talked about you overall are an experimenter, right? I know you use that AI to make a video out of your PDF. How else are you incorporating generative AI, into your workflows?
Jessica Berger I use GPT every day. Pretty much. you may have noticed English is not my first language. So in order just to write good, copy, it's always a helpful tool. It's a great tool for thought starters. Generally speaking for strategy that helps a lot. great because I'm also not a graphic designer.
Jessica Berger It's helpful tool for any image generation needs. So along the lines of everything you could possibly need to replace, having to design a PowerPoint from scratch or make it easier and faster in that regard. So couldn't do it without it.
Ariba Jahan: I heard this one statement he said, it helps me get, off the blank page. And I was that's exactly how I feel about any of these generative AI tools. I don't think I've ever shipped anything that was only created by AI.
Ariba Jahan: And I think it's always been something that either sparked some ideas. there's a lot of massaging going on between the GPT and myself or Claude, whatever tool I'm using, that phrase resonated so much with me, it was like just getting off the blank page,
Jessica Berger Yeah, I mean, there's so many different tools out there. You really have to obviously consider what do you do on a daily basis? What's most helpful to you? And what are you comfortable using? To what degree? Right? Not everyone wants to be out there and dabbling in disabled diffusion and really maybe Jasper.
Jessica Berger io. I always everything they need to just rewrite some copy. do remember the days where you still had to ping your graphic designers, or you had to ping someone else who knew how to use a tool platform in order to help you, create a new cool image or like Photoshop something real quick.
Jessica Berger in the meantime, I had learned them, but nowadays you can literally just, type it in. And that's such an interesting new development overall, I think, where you. Simply taking the hurdles, the challenges of having to navigate complexities, and you're just getting to the result. And in a faster way, I think that's the most interesting thing.
Ariba Jahan: prototypic image, right? sometimes you just need a concept to be able to articulate a point. And instead of taking someone else's time where they're working on something that's a little bit more high priority, you can use a tool like these to get something on paper to get your point across in a deck, So given the timing, let's dive right into the, trend report.for the listeners, I will definitely be linking it in the show notes so people can download it and they can spend their time going through all the trends.
Ariba Jahan: You and your team created this trend report called future forward 2024 one of my favorite parts of trend reports. It's always the beginning, the vision statements and that letter to the reader.
Ariba Jahan: I don't know why, but it's always it casts such a beautiful statement to start with. And yours said, Web3 has emerged as the harmonizer for XR, blockchain and AI technologies. It is shaping a new era in consumer experiences characterized by heightened immersion, decentralization, and intelligence.
Ariba Jahan: Like that was such an energizing statement for me. And then there were the four trends that the report dives into that really supports that vision.So through this conversation, we'll cast a high level definition of the 4, but we'll dive into 2 of them. and I think through that conversation, we'll be able to paint the picture of Why this vision statement is what you guys printed,
Jessica Berger like the name said is more than just ads.
Jessica Berger We actually focus heavily on content. So think about all the brand content opportunities you see here on Netflix streaming platforms. anywhere else other than your typical display ad or programmatic, Facebook ad, whatever, and then innovation. using emerging technologies, hence all of the various categories, all the way into gaming.
Jessica Berger quite a few, categories to cover, but yeah, we nailed it down to sort of. The four main trends, you can call them certainly, there's a huge debate going on, what is the trend anyway, these days, but we're calling them trends, right? At least like directions that are, important for us to digest and that I felt were important to call out for people to understand, because that is what we're seeing is, currently actually changing.
Jessica Berger And really there is a something happening where people are just interacting with the content differently. one, right, rear point is, instant content to commerce opportunities. And I call that out because, well, we're all on our phones every single day on social media, live streams have become a thing.
Jessica Berger Streaming has become a thing. It's an uptick because everything else is just not as important anymore because we're just using so many devices at the same time anyway. But the opportunity to integrate, of course, from a brand perspective, right? And being at an agency, uh, integrating your content into any sort of streaming opportunity, think about all the TikTok live streams you've ever been on or Instagram live streams that we're not so accustomed to.
Jessica Berger And think about all of the opportunities where they're, where you're seeing people actually selling you things in those live streams or the subscription models that have popped up, right? So anywhere between those, the Netflix of the world and subscription models of That's where really media and advertising is living.
Jessica Berger So that was a big one for us to call out. And then these obvious as a second is, the immersive spaces. They're just constantly are top of mind for us. And yes, that's Roblox and Fortnite many others. most importantly, driven by sort of the development of headsets. And we see that Vision Pro being released hopefully early in the spring, or if not earlier.
Ariba Jahan: Yeah,
Jessica Berger least somewhere in the spring. so that's a digital ecosystem. Then we see AI being a huge topic. And I know we can dive into that even more as we have. but the biggest thing there to call out, I think was. you can call it a trend, but Meta, for example, released during Facebook Connect recently, the concept of their AI personas, right?
Jessica Berger Where you actually create a social profile that isn't actually you, but your AI persona of you, where that may or may not be headed. And then finally, gaming is a huge aspect for us, of course. because gaming is no longer just gaming the way we once knew it, but it has really evolved in so many different avenues.
Jessica Berger So four categories that sort of overarched that and then we'll go into details in the report.
Ariba Jahan: thank you so much for casting that, overarching theme . I want to go back to your statement earlier about, what is a trend these days anyway? And so in a world where we are inundated with content, what Everywhere we turn and you said, we are kind of in the season for trend reports anyway.
Ariba Jahan: how are you identifying trends or separating the signal from the noise? I also recognize you use the language direction.
Jessica Berger , I'm open to debating what is a trend and whether or not we want to use it in this context. It makes it easier because when I say trend report people understand what it is that I'm trying to deliver. It makes it easy. Of course, there is this big debate going on, like, yeah, and the world we're hyping so much, especially when it comes to emerging technology.
Jessica Berger Anyway, we're consuming so much content every single day already. when everyone, especially in our little industry, anyway, we're talking about emerging technology all day long. Everyone was talking about metaverse and FT's and where it all is headed, you know, pointing it out in a report seemed. redundant making it a trend may not be what you and I would consider a trend. So there is debate going on. You can take that either way, but for me, it was important just to not go too deep into each category and make it a for sure. Guaranteed predicted. Like, here is what we're saying is going to happen in 2024 or beyond, but it was important for us to call here.
Jessica Berger The things that we're just seeing consistently pop up things that we're seeing investments being made in. Think about the headset. They're not going away. They're going to happen. Are they going to go mainstream? Maybe not, but they will be important for the development and evolution of that direction. So it was important to do that.
Jessica Berger And then again, I wanted to include all the people who actually work behind the scenes who have many, many years and decades of experience in the field of entertainment and media really understand the space and who are to me even more important and have much more value to bring to the support than any, insight support or any, forecasting models that we could have used instead.
Ariba Jahan: I actually really appreciated that because I think to your point, at least for me right now, what I'm looking for is less of a predictive per se, and more of what are the observations that we can pause and notice and just call out to see what may transcend into the next year. or not, but these are the signals of the behaviors that we're seeing around us.
Ariba Jahan: Right? So that was 1 of the reasons I really enjoyed reading the report and the vision statements, obviously. so diving into, the 1st, 1 that really caught my eye, the instant content to commerce technology. Right? So you defined it as the live stream economy.
Ariba Jahan: and that is something that's a new thing that's been happening where the feature of going live has existed across a few different platforms, right? Like, YouTube, Amazon, I can't even remember what else TikTok you can go live on the option to monetize it though become a newer, concept.
Ariba Jahan: And I think you pointed out people's, shopping habits, have also evolved where. I've noticed even my shopping habits have evolved where I might watch something and they say, Oh, link in bio. I'm like, Oh, great. Let me just go to your list. I'm going to see this curated list. And I want to buy from that.
Ariba Jahan: Right. It's like this vetting process. And then I'm like, who is this person that I'm taking their recommendation from like
Jessica Berger it is.
Ariba Jahan: so tell us a little bit more about, this trend.
Jessica Berger there's two layers to it. One is the rise in creator economy. everyone's an influencer, everyone is a content creator, or at least has the opportunity to
Ariba Jahan: mean, we're creating it right now. Right.
Jessica Berger As we speak, and I'm sure at some point in time you would want to run ads or sponsor content or somehow, make use of your channels and your platforms and monetize that, I'm sure you're going to do that successfully, but, that's the point, right?
Jessica Berger on TikTok, anyone can create, content, upload it really, really easily, and then if they're doing it often enough and have all the resources in place, they can also link their Amazon storefront. And that's how we all shop these days. Social commerce is a huge thing. And the same goes with Instagram ads, right?
Jessica Berger Like when's the last time you haven't seen an ad? Or how many times do you actually fall for these ads? And you're actually going for it and shopping through the sponsored content that you're seeing. That's quite a bit. So that's one thing, right? Creator economy isn't going away. It's on the rise. If anything, it's more diversified.
Jessica Berger You see more and more smaller creators actually making use of it. And monetizing their content, their everyday life or their nine to five or time after their nine to five. And so you can really see that being an opportunity for brands to also then go deeper into the micro influencers or just integrating themselves.
Jessica Berger Less as a brand, but more as an opportunity to also help fuel that creator economy in whichever way possible. And yes, platforms like, TikTok, for example, have actually introduced subscription models, which is very interesting because, not everyone is willing to see ads all day long, of course, right?
Jessica Berger Like we're seeing more and more platforms actually introducing ad free options. So how do you still get in front of the audience? that's a huge opportunity for brands to introduce new content or branded opportunities in that regard. And then yes, social live streamers that's selling you content or products, by the second or by the minute, just by showing you something and giving you the opportunity to shop later or shop in the link.
Jessica Berger so that's a huge opportunity. And then same goes for any, streaming platforms, for example, like the Twitch of the world or the Netflix of the world, there's lots of opportunity to think about original content, branded content opportunities, you've ever seen a brand name pop up in one of your favorite, series, then you know, it's branded likely, but it's done in a less intrusive way.
Jessica Berger so there's better and more opportunities that we're seeing that actually pop up in that regard.
Ariba Jahan: It's so interesting that as consumers we've become more open to it too. I think there once was an era where it felt more of an interruption versus now things have become so much more integrated because of user generated content creator economy. And plus, I think brands are blurring the lines a little bit more and Thinking about what type of content will users actually resonate more with. So we're seeing, that as well. I'm curious, in terms of ethical considerations or just concerns that come up, right. For me immediately, I think about hyper consumerism,
Ariba Jahan: I think about, I've definitely gone through lists.
Ariba Jahan: That's like Amazon must haves. I'm like, wait.
Jessica Berger not another list.
Ariba Jahan: What are some considerations you would want anyone to keep in mind as they're building to leverage this trend.
Jessica Berger the de influencing, trend is there for a reason. I think it's showing, just generally speaking, where we as a consumer are paying more and more attention to. And that is the hyper consumerism Same on the brand side, of course, no one likes more ads that is, I think, universally understood. So how can we make that more seamless? More integrated that is a big question I think the opportunity lies also in the way we're sharing the formats or how we're integrating it.
Jessica Berger Think about your favorite TV show that's running on Netflix or Hulu, whichever program you like, Amazon Prime,but like giving people the option rather than, having to shove it into their faces, so to speak, giving them the option to, Hey, if you really like something, you see while it's streaming.
Jessica Berger Yes, you can click pause. And if you would like to click. Pause, maybe you would also like to purchase, but maybe you don't like it. So maybe let's just move on with the movie or your favorite series. I think that's sort of the way we're going. but just being more creative about that and more mindful.
Ariba Jahan: That makes sense. And I think could also see as we keep going that direction, having something like an opt in, right? when you're setting up your Netflix account and being able to say, do not show me recommendations because I have an addiction or I'm trying to, Consume less, right? whatever that might be.
Ariba Jahan: Cause I think we are seeing more and more opt in and opt out mechanisms happen and I love that. I think people need to be more informed aboutthose dynamics at play. so I think that would also be interesting to see. I saw this thing about, choose your own adventure and, your purchase.
Ariba Jahan: Was there anything else you wanted to add from that example?
Jessica Berger that choose your own adventure is a creative hint or not at the way we're looking at media formats, especially as more virtual trying, for example,
Jessica Berger because, to the point of no one likes more ads. How about we make the answers more interactive and more useful? I'm a very practical person.
Jessica Berger I like to shop things that I can use or that I can preview to some degree. And that actually, give me a reassurance that what I'm purchasing is actually something that I want and need. And that will ultimately fit me if we're talking about glasses or if we're talking about fashion, for example, and that's a huge opportunity.
Jessica Berger I think not a lot of brands have really, discovered yet or aren't fully using. And I always like to say like, we'll point back to Amazon prime deal day, right? They have this huge opportunity like on Amazon already. They're using Amazon lens, which is essentially virtual try on, or at least. 3D, preview of the object that you're buying the product.
Jessica Berger So you can actually preview, the toaster that you're about to buy and how would it look in your kitchen corner or, whatever you're trying on, how would the sunglasses look on your face? leveraging that a lot more as an opportunity, that I would recommend to any brand and if you're still, Have not created your 3D files of your inventory. I would highly recommend to do that because that's what we're seeing. happening a lot more, right? Google has already integrated that in their actual shopping search. If you're shopping for sneakers or anything like that, you actually have the opportunity to see them in 3D now.
Jessica Berger And that is something we're seeing more and more. And most brands and client are. I think surprise when they've come to find out like, Oh, you can actually virtual trial and it's something you can integrate in a website. You can embed that as people, are on the website shopping and you can actually add a, click to shop button to it to make that very, very easy and seamless.
Jessica Berger so I think there's lots more opportunity there to really dive into what that could do and what the quality of that looks like.
Ariba Jahan: I love that, especially from, all the angles that you're saying, but also the accessibility part of it too, right? we saw during the pandemic, so many D2C brands, boom, because people wanted to just buy their things from the internet, because that was the only option that we
Ariba Jahan: had. And then now I think with virtual try ons, there are people who are still not able to go out. That much, whether they have chronic illnesses or, they have a physical or mobility disability, or you're a mom who needs to be home, tethered to this child all the time.
Jessica Berger in my case, I don't even like shopping malls all that
Jessica Berger much, or at least in the U. S. They're kind of terrible, right? The experience is not that great. And so oftentimes we go to the mall maybe for fun and we window shop a little bit or we browse around. But ultimately we go home because we want to take care of and use all the discounts we have and get all the points and whatever.
Jessica Berger Or not you're collecting. Right. and that's typically what happens. We're seeing more and more, right? People still love the real life experience. Of course, going shopping will never go away in that regard. but just being more creative about how you can present a product. I think there's so much more opportunity and especially if you're thinking really about immersive experiences, right?
Jessica Berger If you're talking bigger brand experiences of how you just drive awareness to your product. that's such an underutilized area at all. Totally from a virtual try on perspective, using all the avatars and the digital humans that are out there in all games and all the social environments, you could actually get really, really creative.
Jessica Berger And I have not seen a lot of brands actually dive into that.
Ariba Jahan: hopefully people that are listening are going to experiment. one question I had that I never thought about until this conversation is when you do virtual try ons. And it scans like the space or it scans my body in order to layer it.
Ariba Jahan: It's getting access to, through my camera and it's scanning. is that data stored and then access later on? Cause then I'm thinking about data privacy, people who might not realize this virtual try is storing that data. So they're getting in front of it naked.
Jessica Berger I think that's really, I can't speak for every platform. Everyone does it differently. Most of the time they give you a little, Window pop up that says, hey, we're, tracking the data right now for the use of you trying it on, but afterwards it will be deleted. So most people are deleting it.
Jessica Berger Yes. Of course, have to opt in into the experience. So that is completely up to you, whether or not you're comfortable with that. And you trust that that is actually happening. there is the better question of, like, who actually follows up on that, but yeah, generally speaking, they will delete the commission.
Ariba Jahan: I haven't used too many of the try on technologies. They sometimes don't work for me. It's a little glitchy, but I think to your point, the technology is going to keep evolving, but I will definitely make a note to notice what the language is around the, around the data.
Jessica Berger I'm a huge fan and I can see the quality evolving already, which is,
Ariba Jahan: Do you have a favorite? Do you have a favorite
Jessica Berger I always recommend if you're comfortable, furniture shopping and go to the good old, Ikea, for example, or any good, store that is selling you a rug likely have a virtual feature where you can place the rock in your place. Or if you go to a sheen, for example, right now, they have a beautiful opportunity to really try and all of the clothing items.
Ariba Jahan: so shifting into the AI at the crossroads of identity and social life, trend, tell us more about that.
Jessica Berger Yeah, that's a really interesting one. One that's highly evolving. it's kind of based around the idea that, I mean, one, we're already seeing so many, prototypes or use cases where brands have tried or platforms have tried to use NPCs characters or arbiters to some degree too. Make them more interactive.
Jessica Berger And if you infuse some AI in order to make the conversation more interesting while you're gaming and while you're interacting with them. So that's one part where I'm thinking, Oh, that will definitely evolve when we see more of. So as you're thinking about all the games that are coming out or all the new interaction points where you have, where you are in Roblox, for example, or in Fortnite, right?
Jessica Berger why wouldn't you want to play as an NPC or an avatar? Or use your character in order to have it be more engaging as 1 part. And
Jessica Berger then
Jessica Berger the interesting part we're seeing for many companies like a snap or a meta pop up is the idea around, AI humans, essentially, right? Replicating a digital twin of yourself so that whoever is interacting.
Jessica Berger On social media will always have an opportunity to interact with no matter the time of the day, because there's an twin or persona of yourself available 24/7 so that's the really interesting part. Like, when you are on social media, and we all are to some degree on. Whichever platform, to think about who are you interacting with?
Jessica Berger concept is not new. I think the question we always had is is someone catfishing us? Is someone on the other side asking who they are? If you're not seeing them in a video call like this, but no more so than ever, right? if you're interacting with an avatar, if you're interacting with a virtual human.
Jessica Berger Is that the person that you're talking to, or is it just a virtual human that is AI driven and to what degree I'm comfortable with that, there's many questions around that, but that's something that we're seeing. And I'm very, very interested to see it all.
Ariba Jahan: mean, it's such a great point because remember when chatbots. or the rage, And everyone wanted to create a chat bot. And some of the chat bots were formulated kind of a FAQ style. And some of the chat bots were more of little bit of a choose your own adventure type of style.
Ariba Jahan: And now what we're seeing is with AI generated utility, we're going to see a a lot of shifts in that. Right. And to your point, how human do we need that experience to be? human as in do we need it to be generative or are people are gonna be like, I don't know what this is, but can you just get me a representative?
Jessica Berger the hope is that those old school, terrible chatbot interactions will become obsolete and replace them with actually something functional, conversational that is actually working and giving us the result that we're looking for so we don't have call into the screen, please give me a representative. but the idea is also how transparent are brands or people in their regard, right? We saw that example, I From celebrities, right? Like if you have, Snoop Dogg AI, human, so to speak in front of you, and you're interacting with that on social media. Are you aware that it is not Snoop Dogg?
Jessica Berger And are you comfortable with that? And what is Snoop Dogg AI sharing versus does Snoop Dogg know that there is an AI sharing something about him and is he
Ariba Jahan: That part. Yeah, that's exactly what I was going to bring up because I think now it makes me wonder, when you are creating this digital AI powered, persona, people are going to take information that's available on the internet, whether it's, Snoop Dogg's, scripts, right? Taking what he says and then infusing it for his tone. But at what point do you need permission to use his likeness, right? I saw 2 examples. I saw 1 where, I don't know if you know her. She's, uh, incredible and technologist. but I saw her talk about it in her tech talk and she talked about how, an AI persona was created in her likeness and uses all of the content she's created as information for that.
Ariba Jahan: And I was. Like, oh my goodness, there she is putting her heart and soul into our content. And then this AI was fed that so that someone can interact with it and it would say the same things, right? Similar things and in
Jessica Berger Who is managing it, who, who's giving the permission, and, and then tying it. Let me tie you this back to as to why I made the introduction in the upfront of the report about Web3, right, the next iteration of the internet and why it's coming together with the foundation of mixed reality. So xr, ar, vr, an augmented reality and we're talking about artificial intelligence and the.
Jessica Berger Proliferation of blockchain technologies, all of that enabling sort of Web 3. 0 together, because if you think about it, wouldn't it be great if there was a way to verify and to acknowledge whether or not something is real or not blockchain. Experiences make that happen for us and a wonderful opportunity to actually solve for that.
Jessica Berger So, I don't think we're going to ever be able to, move ahead and think everything is going to be real or everything is going to be verifiable on the Internet, but understanding that there are solutions that we could implement or work towards like blockchain technologies to actually, you know, ensure that there is a secure and transparent information sharing going on without having the fear that every video is a deep fake or every persona is not actually real.
Ariba Jahan: I think the nexus that we are at right now, because all these questions are being raised and people want to know, how do we solve for this? Because we are seeing it, right? none of this is going to slow down, but these questions are at the nexus and we're trying to figure out, in order for more people and more brands and more people to use them.
Ariba Jahan: And more brands to use them, but then also more people to trust, to even feel confident that they know what to trust. Right. I think that is really essential here in order for brand
Jessica Berger And to be fair, I think, there's lots of opportunity in using these digital twins, right? I think there is a use case for it. I don't think, quite there yet to, them over to the world and mainstream media or everyone in the hopes that everyone is using them in the right way.
Jessica Berger I think there will always be bad actors who will figure out how to not use them in the right way. but I think there is something interesting there. We can actually think. Yeah, it makes sense to have a digital twin, right? If you think about all the work, every meeting ever where you felt like, I don't need to be here. someone else can do the prep call or whatever it is. it makes a lot of sense. Or if you think about all the opportunities where you want to engage as a celebrity or an influencer with your audience globally, but they're all speaking different languages. How do you manage that at scale?
Jessica Berger Or branded opportunities. Of course, from a media perspective, it makes a lot of sense. whether or not, it's going to replace anyone. I don't think so, of course. but there's still a little bit of work to be done as far as figuring out what that means for transparency
Ariba Jahan: you brought up celebrities, right? one example was exactly what you're saying. If a celebrity or an artist has to engage a global audience, like what are some other reasons that this is actually advantageous for people?
Jessica Berger from a brand perspective, it makes sense to be more personal or more personal and to have it be a highly personalized experience, If you interacting with, the Samsung AI on Facebook. And it's a really interesting, intimate conversation and you're actually getting, the content that you're looking for, rather than, the old school chat experience.
Jessica Berger I think there is a use case there and to make it really interesting, or if you, actually feel like you want to talk to a therapist, or you feel like you want to talk to, your nutritionist, everyone who has a. career in some degree can probably say, oh, there is a certain chunk of my work that I want to outsource because it's, it's mundane or it's the same over and over again.
Jessica Berger And the same way that we're sending out emails with like. Here is your intake form, please fill out the whatever questions having that co pilot and the companion experience available to your audience or whichever need, whether or not you, it's just a fan base because you're a celebrity or because you're a customer and someone is, your dentist and you just want to check in on Hey, is everything going well?
Jessica Berger Right. just a regular routine check ins, those kinds of scenarios I can see work really, really well.
Ariba Jahan: what we're already seeing is you said, nutrition, fitness. I think I've seen some examples there where, there's an AI tool that is already fed a lot of information and you can kind of utilize it and engage with it.
Ariba Jahan: So it can give you recommendations for nutrition for a specific diet. you can tell it I'm keto or I'm gluten free and it can give you nutritional guidance or, recipes and menus and such. and I know we're seeing a similar type of application of AI and in many other industries, including financial advisory.
Ariba Jahan: Right. And I think a lot of these tools are, paywall, right? They're not free because these businesses want to make money. So I think what we're also going to start seeing is an Increase of a gap between people who can afford access to these tools that are more efficient, more productive, all of these things versus people who can't who can't afford that luxury of yes, I don't have the time to read.
Ariba Jahan: 30 articles about how to count my macronutrients. So I'm going to use this AI tool and pay for it versus everyone else. Who's like, I can't pay for that. So I'm going to have to go, the other way. So I think we might see the gap exists there between people who are leveraging these tools and people who are not.
Jessica Berger Yeah, the other day talking with someone about a different scenario and I'll play here where everyone who doesn't or isn't able to afford access to a real person to like your real therapist has to deal with sort of the lower base and that is just your AI version of that right where you get sort of basic needs covered and then ultimately you can upgrade or subscribe and then you get access to the real person being real has this luxury notion, I think, in a world where everything isAI enhanced at the very least.
Jessica Berger Right. this is obviously a concept that is more, a couple of years out. We're talking here, not necessarily today or tomorrow, but in a world where a lot of content is already, AI generated, or at least enhanced to some degree today. We're not actually writing all of the.
Jessica Berger Social media content, 75 percent of what you're seeing on a daily is probably already enhanced to some degree.
Ariba Jahan: , so I know that there's also AI enhanced audio, creation and song creations and all of that. Do you think we're walking into a new era where. Creators and artists are going to, maybe it's already happening. Like how do they own their likenesses, right?
Ariba Jahan: Like we saw the viral AI generated Drake song happened, right. Where everyone kept on talking about it and then it was taken off I think it was on Spotify and then it got taken down or YouTube. That technology already exists, how do creators take back some power or get royalty?
Ariba Jahan: I think that's the next question there too, right?
Jessica Berger And I think yet again, blockchain seems to be a very interesting solution to that problem, isn't it? When you can actually Google, for example, Google, for example, right? They have their platform already available where you can mix and match or get your sense for music. Right. And you can actually create something.
Jessica Berger And there's many other platforms currently, popping up on the internet where you can actually, remix your own music, whether or not that is legal is a different story. And I think there is still a lot of debate happening and a lot of cases it's not, but the idea
Jessica Berger I think would be interesting to explore of using blockchain technology in order to enable, like
Jessica Berger fair and authentic and real, role sharing, for example, Making sure everyone gets paid who has been involved and making sure that everyone gets their fair share.
Jessica Berger So, again, just a good example where, the next iteration of the Internet where free can have a lot of new components that we just haven't seen it as far as quantum consumption creation and just earning what you're actually producing.
Ariba Jahan: So how far are we from that though? You've said this a few times that blockchain can help us prove the authenticity the truth, as well as make sure that it's distributing royalties and funds equitably. So the people who are the creators can benefit from that.
Jessica Berger I think it's in the works. I've seen it being explored already. I know there's a lot of startups that are currently focusing on that. the, part that people need to keep in mind, there was a lot of funding throughout, early 2021 while the hype was happening. A lot of funding occurred in the web three startup space.
Jessica Berger but building a company, I'm sure you are well aware. It takes a lot of time and sometimes it works out, sometimes it doesn't, but products need to be developed and that doesn't happen overnight. So if you consider the funding that happened, I don't know, two years ago, building a company in that current frame, like actually building a product and go to market strategy and making sure that everything's working, you're not going to get to see the results until like, I don't know.
Jessica Berger Five years from now, But in five years, there is a good chance that a lot of new platforms and apps and opportunities are popping up where we're all of a sudden saying, Oh, why wasn't that available, you know, previously, or where does that come from? Well, yeah, because all of the startups are currently still
Jessica Berger building. And but I think it's definitely happening. And I'm giving it a very optimistic, chance to actually, becoming true. .
Ariba Jahan: Okay. So, let's bring it home. I'm going to share a few rapid fire questions. Jessica, how are you nurturing your mental health these days?
Jessica Berger I don't recommend it to everyone, but I am one of the five o'clock in the morning. People who gets to the gym, very early, gets it outta the way, and then moves on with the day, but it helps a lot.
Ariba Jahan: When do you go to sleep?
Jessica Berger On a good day, anywhere between nine and 10.
Ariba Jahan: Okay.
Jessica Berger I drink a lot of coffee to balance it out. I don't recommend getting up early. It's not for everyone. but I started doing it two years ago. It's stuck. I know I can't shake it even if I, you know, don't set my alarm, but it helps a lot. It just gives you a lot of freedom in the morning.
Jessica Berger It's true. Whatever you want to say, like, it's just quiet in the morning. If you are that kind of person, I'm the introvert, right? I like to charge up in the morning, get my, coffee in, go work out. it helps tremendously just to Free up space and then you have the rest of the day to actually focus on the work ahead.
Ariba Jahan: I mean, you essentially start your day by pouring into your cup first before giving to your work or anything else, right?
Jessica Berger Yeah, and then whatever's happening can just come and you're still good. You got your workout in, no worries.
Ariba Jahan: How do you nurture your curiosity?
Jessica Berger Constantly learning. I mean, I do that on a daily basis for my job anyway, but I do like to travel, for example, I'm definitely that person. also not just learning new, but a curiosity by just revisiting lots of old stuff that you may have forgotten. Because we consume so much content, right? Lots of media and lots of just knowledge and expertise, but we also forget a lot.
Jessica Berger So sometimes just like looking back in an old book or like looking back on old notes and remembering, okay, what did I do earlier this year? I don't know. Like a lot of times we don't even remember. So looking back and remembering a lot of things.
Ariba Jahan: who is up next? Who are some people that listeners can follow along or learn from?
Jessica Berger Yeah, there's a lot of people. I highly recommend you follow along. If you're into careers in the media space and you have not seen yet, Kuala, definitely lots of great strategy and innovation thinking as we're looking to what's next. there's also other people, Ellie K.
Jessica Berger Muller, for example, who is big in the AI space and she has a lot of great wisdom. So, or Shanelle Bole that you mentioned, she is a wonderful.
Ariba Jahan: I love that list and we'll definitely include it in the show notes so people can find them. And then I know we talked about a lot of different topics, but I think focusing mostly on the two trends we hyper focused on, the content to commerce and the AI being at the crossroads of identity and social life.
Ariba Jahan: Like, what do you think is up next for those directions?
Jessica Berger I think what we're going to see is just more seamless content creation. And I think people need to understand that we're all consuming or creating content, it's one or the other, it's not going to go away. So, less ads in the traditional way, but more opportunities to seamless connect, lots of opportunities to talk about something, create something, sell you something, but also like, Hey, let's debate whether or not it was useful or not, but like have it be more seamless. opportunity to really integrate content and then generally speaking, I mean, the technologies will evolve and then we're definitely gonna have to revisit and reflect in a year where we're not, there's, actually pan out the way we thought they did.
Ariba Jahan: I feel like 2024 December, we can regroup and talk about so what did happen?
Jessica Berger I would love that
Ariba Jahan: Well, thank you so much, Jessica, for joining us today for having this conversation. I had a blast.
Jessica Berger Oh, thank you so much. This is great.

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